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Topic ClosedHide your beagle Vicks an Eagle

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Hide your beagle Vicks an Eagle
    Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:10am
Can't believe someone picked him up in the NFL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:17am
Not really sure how I feel about this.  I now hate the Eagles more than I did though.  Go SKINS!!!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:17am
Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Not really sure how I feel about this.  I now hate the Eagles more than I did though.  Go SKINS!!!


Yeah, the skins don't have any shitbags on their team. LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:19am
None that willingly murdered dogs.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:39am
Originally posted by BRUIZZA

None that willingly murdered dogs.


Stop it.

What about albert haynesworth who, out of anger, stomped on a players face with metal spikes on and was also indicted for DUI and wreckless driving?  (multiple times, and while doing it on probation)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:40am
I'm a Giants fan, so I hate the Eagles.
 
That being said, I'm glad he's getting another shot. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:41am
I hate the guy, but it should be a fun offense to watch. Vick, Westbrook, and Desean Jackson are all explosive hybrid players that can be moved into different scenarios.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 10:54am
I hate him too, thats not my argument.  I just think people are entitled to second chances, and are allowed to try to make good on their past discrepancies.  If he screws up again, then im 100% with you.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 11:03am
Hey i was against the Haynesworth signing.  Hell I went to college with the guy and didn't like him then.  I was also at that game when he stomped on dude's face.  I still think what Vick did was messed up but I am not saying he doesn't deserve a second chance.  Hell Ray Lewis was implicated in murder and wasn't even suspended.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 11:18am
Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Hey i was against the Haynesworth signing.  Hell I went to college with the guy and didn't like him then.  I was also at that game when he stomped on dude's face.  I still think what Vick did was messed up but I am not saying he doesn't deserve a second chance.  Hell Ray Lewis was implicated in murder and wasn't even suspended.


We're on the same page then.  Good thing since we'll be state-mates soonish, i wanna be on a boat!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 11:22am
I heard a rumor he was coming to the Seahawks and almost cried, but! The eagles can have him, I want none o' him! I can't believe he still is gettin a career after being caught for that and put in jail.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 12:11pm
wish he woulda came out west. don't really care what the man did in his private life, he paid his dues to society, moreso than the average man would've had to. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by mattaleao

Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Hey i was against the Haynesworth signing.  Hell I went to college with the guy and didn't like him then.  I was also at that game when he stomped on dude's face.  I still think what Vick did was messed up but I am not saying he doesn't deserve a second chance.  Hell Ray Lewis was implicated in murder and wasn't even suspended.


We're on the same page then.  Good thing since we'll be state-mates soonish, i wanna be on a boat!
Yes, what he did was terrible but the fact that people get so upset about this, but not so much so when a human life is endangered is what I don't understand.

E.A.G.L.E.S. EAGLES.

Originally posted by giftedhands67

wish he woulda came out west. don't really care what the man did in his private life, he paid his dues to society, moreso than the average man would've had to. 
Yes. Thank you. Too bad, though--he's all Philly's. Big smileClap
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 2:36pm
Cheezy don't you know the Eagles sucks? LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:12pm
The question I have is - is this guy still any good considering he's been sitting in a jail cell for how long?

I imagine he's going to be a bit out of practice. I'm sure he's probably still in decent shape. I mean, he was in jail - not much to do but work out. how much practice has he really had with a football though?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:23pm
Originally posted by myke

The question I have is - is this guy still any good considering he's been sitting in a jail cell for how long?

I imagine he's going to be a bit out of practice. I'm sure he's probably still in decent shape. I mean, he was in jail - not much to do but work out. how much practice has he really had with a football though?



um.. isnt that the point? Vick isnt a qb anyhow, hes a runningback that occasionally passes.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:27pm
Originally posted by mattaleao

I hate him too, thats not my argument.  I just think people are entitled to second chances, and are allowed to try to make good on their past discrepancies.  If he screws up again, then im 100% with you.
 
What about the dogs? They never had a chance at all.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:35pm
Originally posted by giftedhands67

Originally posted by myke

The question I have is - is this guy still any good considering he's been sitting in a jail cell for how long?

I imagine he's going to be a bit out of practice. I'm sure he's probably still in decent shape. I mean, he was in jail - not much to do but work out. how much practice has he really had with a football though?



um.. isnt that the point? Vick isnt a qb anyhow, hes a runningback that occasionally passes.


Yea - but there's still more to it then just being big or running fast. You still have to have the reflexes and the mind to play. That's more what i'm talking about.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:37pm
I've had this discussion before, and it came down to the fact that he served his time and payed his debt to society so he should be allowed to have a second chance.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by myke

Originally posted by giftedhands67

Originally posted by myke

The question I have is - is this guy still any good considering he's been sitting in a jail cell for how long?

I imagine he's going to be a bit out of practice. I'm sure he's probably still in decent shape. I mean, he was in jail - not much to do but work out. how much practice has he really had with a football though?



um.. isnt that the point? Vick isnt a qb anyhow, hes a runningback that occasionally passes.


Yea - but there's still more to it then just being big or running fast. You still have to have the reflexes and the mind to play. That's more what i'm talking about.



ah ok. i'd still bet on Vick coming back strong, maybe not in game 1, but give the man some camp time and im sure it'll fall back into place. hes only 29.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:48pm
Originally posted by BethH

I've had this discussion before, and it came down to the fact that he served his time and payed his debt to society so he should be allowed to have a second chance.




As much as I hate what he did. That is kind of how it works.
My hang up is - fine, he repaid his debt to society, and he should be allowed out of jail.

The question then becomes - what type of organization is the NFL that they have no problems looking the other way when it comes to serious lack of judgement and/or moral character. Vick sort of put that in the spotlight a little bit, but more and more over the years the NFL and the NBA have sort of catered to a very 'thug' sort of mentality with their players.
By not taking a stand, they essentially tell these players that it's okay to act in a way that would land most normal people in jail. I just can't really support that, at all.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 3:56pm
wait what? who was that NFL player who just KILLED somebody whilst drunk driving, and basically just paid the family off? the NFL isn't a church, its a sports league. He went bankrupt, went to prison.. what more do people really want from this man? If he repaid his debt to society, then isnt that all to be said about it? i mean, he didnt really repay his debt if people still want more blood from the man. what should his punishment be then, should he never be allowed to play football again, ever? 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 4:00pm
Originally posted by giftedhands67

wait what? who was that NFL player who just KILLED somebody whilst drunk driving, and basically just paid the family off? the NFL isn't a church, its a sports league. He went bankrupt, went to prison.. what more do people really want from this man? If he repaid his debt to society, then isnt that all to be said about it? i mean, he didnt really repay his debt if people still want more blood from the man. what should his punishment be then, should he never be allowed to play football again, ever? 


It's a reflection on the team, and the sport as a whole.

A lot of public personalities have morality clauses in their contracts for exactly this reason. If you want to go out and kill somebody in a DUI situation, that's fine - but we reserve the right to can your ass as a result.

What it says - is that the teams, and the league, literally support people who clearly show a lack of judgment and maturity.

Does that mean they should never be allowed to play again? No - I'm not saying that. I'm saying I think it's kind of sick that the guy can literally go from prison, straight back into a uniform.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 4:13pm
yea, i get that part of it, but i think the purpose of jail is *supposed* to be about rehabilitation. One of the largest problems with prisons, is that once people get out, they can't find work, because of their record, and often turn back to the same crimes that put them in prison to begin with. That might not hold as true a story for a guy in such a high demand like Michael Vick, but i don't agree with the idea, (and im not saying this is your idea myke), that ex-cons should never get jobs. 

im not trying to defend what he did, but i do think he took enough lashes for it. He paid all the money he had to, and spent all the time in prison he had to. I dont think there should be a mourning period between jail and when he can play again, if he's completely paid his debt, then put his ass in a jersey.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 6:24pm
I think its good for him he got reinstated. He did his time and should be able to play. Theres many people that have done much worse and still been able to play. It would have been nice to see him back in atlanta but i personaly like matt ryan better as a QB
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 7:33pm
You also have to realize that it BENEFITS the humane society, SPCA, etc to have him still being famous and playing in the NFL, he can do more good there then if he was humping lumber for $7 an hour and everyone forgot about him.

It's in all of those groups' best interest that he continue to play.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 9:37pm
i agree with gifted. he served his sentence, got out, and got a job doing what he does well. it just so happens that that particular job is playing football and pays very well.

the same people complaining are probably the same people crying for equality for "born again" ex-cons (not pointing fingers at anyone here, just speaking in general terms).

here's what i DO disagree with:

i don't believe Vick served enough time. yes, he spent near 3x more in jail for persons convicted of dog fighting (people in the South are statistically shown to spend an average of 6 months jail time for dog fighting convictions). but, i don't feel the actual sentence was enough, just like how i don't believe 6 months of jail time for sexual offenders is NEARLY enough either.

i also hate how much publicity he's getting. just like gifted stated, Donte Stallworth (from sacramento), hit and killed a man while driving under the influence. he spent 24 DAYS in jail and sent an undisclosed amount of money to the family. why are people not complaining about this?

i love animals. i love dogs. i see dogs as an extension of the family, but many people see them only as pets. taking that point of view into consideration, why are we making a much larger issue out of killing an animal than a human life? our priorities are obviously way out of whack.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/14/2009 at 9:40pm
P.S. anyone want to make a friendly wager? i bet that if Vick plays any kind of a large part in the Eagles and having a winning record and/or doing well enough to go to the Bowl, talk of not wanting Vick anymore will be out the window. everyone will praise him like a god. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 4:51am
Originally posted by xxsweet_jen24xx

Originally posted by mattaleao

I hate him too, thats not my argument.  I just think people are entitled to second chances, and are allowed to try to make good on their past discrepancies.  If he screws up again, then im 100% with you.
 
What about the dogs? They never had a chance at all.


a lot of the Vick dogs that were taken from his house went through extensive retraining and were all found good homes

Originally posted by esy.iam

P.S. anyone want to make a friendly wager? i bet that if Vick plays any kind of a large part in the Eagles and having a winning record and/or doing well enough to go to the Bowl, talk of not wanting Vick anymore will be out the window. everyone will praise him like a god. 


i believe Vick will deliver but it's too early to tell.  we shall see come week 6 if he will even play.  Mcnabb is injury prone so Vick might get to start sooner than later.

did anybody hear or know about Vick running a red light and hitting someone the night he got signed?  i guess its a hoax since i can't find anything on google
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 6:42am
Originally posted by tk177

Originally posted by esy.iam

P.S. anyone want to make a friendly wager? i bet that if Vick plays any kind of a large part in the Eagles and having a winning record and/or doing well enough to go to the Bowl, talk of not wanting Vick anymore will be out the window. everyone will praise him like a god. 


i believe Vick will deliver but it's too early to tell.  we shall see come week 6 if he will even play.  Mcnabb is injury prone so Vick might get to start sooner than later.


definitely. i'm just saying, if he does play any kind of a large part in the Eagles' success this season especially a Super Bowl berth, everyone will have forgotten the whole dog fighting thing.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 12:13pm
Originally posted by esy.iam

i agree with gifted. he served his sentence, got out, and got a job doing what he does well. it just so happens that that particular job is playing football and pays very well.

i love animals. i love dogs. i see dogs as an extension of the family, but many people see them only as pets. taking that point of view into consideration, why are we making a much larger issue out of killing an animal than a human life? our priorities are obviously way out of whack.
+1 I had some guy at a bar last night get all pissy with me because I supported Vick playing on the team. (I think he threw a table-marker in my general direction). Then I walked outside while he was out there, and we talked about it. He showed me pics of his pit bull that just died of cancer...  The guy was cute, too.

Anyways, even if dogs/animals are viewed as an extension of the family, a HUMAN life is a HUMAN life. No one protested Stallworth...

Originally posted by esy.iam


definitely. i'm just saying, if he does play any kind of a large part in the Eagles' success this season especially a Super Bowl berth, everyone will have forgotten the whole dog fighting thing.
haha. He's playing for Philly...it'll be a love/hate relationship all season...depending on how he does. <3

Originally posted by NickinChicago

Cheezy don't you know the Eagles sucks? LOL
Crazy talk.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 12:18pm
it looks like he has gained some weight compared to when he left the nfl
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 12:30pm
Out of curiosity, I looked up ticket info for a Giants-Eagles game. It's the Sunday after my bday in December...$203 for decent seats...could even get some in the lower end zone, but I think I'd want to be along the sides.


Cheezy Football Birthday Fund?
http://www.footballbabble.com/football/nfl/philadelphia-eagles/cheerleaders/eagles-cheerleaders.jpg
motivation/bribery.

*Thought maybe I should let this thread stay safe for work.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 2:21pm
Originally posted by tk177

Originally posted by xxsweet_jen24xx

Originally posted by mattaleao

I hate him too, thats not my argument.  I just think people are entitled to second chances, and are allowed to try to make good on their past discrepancies.  If he screws up again, then im 100% with you.
 
What about the dogs? They never had a chance at all.


a lot of the Vick dogs that were taken from his house went through extensive retraining and were all found good homes
 
What about the ones that were already dead due to the dog fights? Pretty sure they didn't get to go to good homes. I'm glad that some of the dogs were able to be saved and sent to good homes, but I gaurantee you that wasn't the case for all of them. I'm willing to bet a lot of them were put down, because it's hard to break a dog of that mindset when they have been taught since birth to fight.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 3:03pm
I wonder how the family of the person Stallworth hit/killed is doing. Someone should start a thread about that.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/15/2009 at 4:49pm
Originally posted by xxsweet_jen24xx

Originally posted by tk177

Originally posted by xxsweet_jen24xx

Originally posted by mattaleao

I hate him too, thats not my argument.  I just think people are entitled to second chances, and are allowed to try to make good on their past discrepancies.  If he screws up again, then im 100% with you.
 
What about the dogs? They never had a chance at all.


a lot of the Vick dogs that were taken from his house went through extensive retraining and were all found good homes
 
What about the ones that were already dead due to the dog fights? Pretty sure they didn't get to go to good homes. I'm glad that some of the dogs were able to be saved and sent to good homes, but I gaurantee you that wasn't the case for all of them. I'm willing to bet a lot of them were put down, because it's hard to break a dog of that mindset when they have been taught since birth to fight.
Jen out of the ~60 dogs they took from Vick less than 5 had to be put down.  1 of them had to have her teeth removed and like 2 others werent able to be rehabilitated due to the dog fighting.  All the rest were adopted out.  As much as I hate Vick for what he did to those Pits him getting in trouble actually brought more positive press for Pits than any other event.  That is one reason I am so on the fence about him.  If he hadnt of gotten caught Pits wouldn't have gotten all the good press they got. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2009 at 8:44am
Is he a piece of sh*t, yeah, but you can't take away his entire life for the dogs. 

Jen, do you want him to never be able to make money again? Never have a life? Should we have put him to death? 

I LOVE dogs. I own a great dog, and I've had dogs my entire life. When I think about what he did to those dogs, there are not words to describe how thoroughly disgusted I am, but he's a person. People make mistakes, he's fulfilled the penalty society prescribed. So now he needs to move on, and we need to let him. It sucks that he's a football player and will probably end up living a pretty good life again but if he's going to go get a job, we have no right to tell him what jobs he can and can't get. I applaud no one in this situation, but everyone is doing what they think is best. The NFL (which has only conditionally reinstated him, last reports I heard he's not cleared to play in games yet) thinks he can end up being a good story and bring something to the league. The Eagles, despite all the talk of second chances because of Reid's sons, think he can help their team or they wouldn't have signed him. And everyone doing what they think is best is how it's supposed to work.

You do have a say in all of this though, if you don't like it, vote with your wallet.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2009 at 1:48pm
I don't think he did anything specific to the dogs did he?  He was stupid and made some bad calls by allowing his place to be used but I don't think he was doing the training and putting the dogs in to fight was he?  There were plenty more people more explicitly involved who got off a lot lighter...

I'm glad he is allowed to play, I hope he does amazingly well just to spite all the haters and self-righteous people who have clearly never made any mistakes in their lives.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2009 at 3:28pm

Where the heck do people get, "Should we have put him to death?" from what I have said? All I said was what about the dogs, I never said he didn't serve his time, or that he should never be allowed to have a job again. I didn't say anything like that, so don't twist my words around.

I don't understand why people are so upset because I care more about the dogs than I do about Vick getting to play in the NFL again. I could care less that he gets to play again. Would I have let him back in if I were the persons in charge? No. However, I don't think that anyone who is convicted of a felony and is sent to prison should be allowed back into a major sports league like that. I'm not just talking about Vick, I'm talking about all of the people mentioned above who have done equally if not worse things, and anyone else. Sure, they should be able to move on with their lives and have jobs after they have served their time, but to me, playing in a major sports league is a privilege, not a right.
 
I mean, think about it, these guys are role models, rather they like it or not. Little kids look up to them and want to be like them. What does that teach the children who idolize these guys when they see them being implicated for dog fighting, or murder, or driving under the influence and killing someone's family member? Even more, what does it teach them when these people are allowed to keep playing proffessional sports and make lots of money and remain famous after what they have done?
 
I understand that they are all just humans, but when you are in their situation, you know that you are a role model and kids are looking up to you. You are expected to uphold a certain image, and they all know that going into things. I wouldn't feel sorry for anyone who got banned from a major sports league for committing a crime, because just as they are humans, they are also adults, and as adults, we all know right from wrong, do we not?
 
Anyways, I got carried away, and I'm sorry.
 
Also, Bru, thank you for clearing that up for me, I wasn't aware that so many of the dogs were able to be rehabilitized. I honestly didn't follow the story all that deeply, I just know the basics. It's surprising that so many of them made it, because a lot of dogs in that situation aren't so lucky.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2009 at 4:11pm
So be there for your kid and don't rely on sports stars to be their role models. Tell your kids why its ok for them to look-up to Vick's tremendous talent on the field but how he's making mistakes that for a lot of people are unforgiveable. In short, don't rely on society to raise your child.

My point is basically you can't tell the guy to go get a job and be a part of society again, then tell him but you can't have that job, as long as the job has nothing to do with his crime.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/16/2009 at 6:27pm
My only qualm with this situation is that people are so up in arms about this particular situation because it's the only of its kind that is known. I'm sure that there are countless athletes out there committing far worse atrocities that go unmentioned. I am with everyone else in saying that I do feel he paid for his crime in full if not more than that...had this been the average Joe you wouldn't seen half of America being up in arms...it would run in the local papers for a day or two and people would forget. Because of Vick's celebrity status his actions will FOREVER be remembered and he will continue to pay whether it be physically or mentally. We've all committed acts that people, had they known, would frown upon...but don't we expect to be given another opportunity?


Interesting video on 60 minutes: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5245553n

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/17/2009 at 2:16pm
Originally posted by Kieren24

I don't think he did anything specific to the dogs did he?  He was stupid and made some bad calls by allowing his place to be used but I don't think he was doing the training and putting the dogs in to fight was he?  There were plenty more people more explicitly involved who got off a lot lighter...

I'm glad he is allowed to play, I hope he does amazingly well just to spite all the haters and self-righteous people who have clearly never made any mistakes in their lives.
I am guessing you didn't pay a bit of shtooking attention to what went on and what he was charged with.  He MURDERED dogs that didn't perform well in DOG FIGHTS.  He ELECTROCUTED THEM, DROWNED THEM, AND HUNG THEM.  Yes HE did those things himself not just the other guys involved.  You know why they got off lighter???  They told the shtooking truth and didn't proclaim their innocence then only tell the truth once everyone else did like Vick. 

So I guess all of us who think that is WRONG and is way worse than a mistake are just full of spite and hate.  Have I made mistakes and poor decisions before hell yes.  Have I willingly murdered animals because they did not do well at fighting other animals no I have not. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/17/2009 at 4:48pm
Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Originally posted by Kieren24

I don't think he did anything specific to the dogs did he?  He was stupid and made some bad calls by allowing his place to be used but I don't think he was doing the training and putting the dogs in to fight was he?  There were plenty more people more explicitly involved who got off a lot lighter...

I'm glad he is allowed to play, I hope he does amazingly well just to spite all the haters and self-righteous people who have clearly never made any mistakes in their lives.
I am guessing you didn't pay a bit of shtooking attention to what went on and what he was charged with.  He MURDERED dogs that didn't perform well in DOG FIGHTS.  He ELECTROCUTED THEM, DROWNED THEM, AND HUNG THEM.  Yes HE did those things himself not just the other guys involved.  You know why they got off lighter???  They told the shtooking truth and didn't proclaim their innocence then only tell the truth once everyone else did like Vick. 

So I guess all of us who think that is WRONG and is way worse than a mistake are just full of spite and hate.  Have I made mistakes and poor decisions before hell yes.  Have I willingly murdered animals because they did not do well at fighting other animals no I have not. 
 
Yup, pretty sure I hate the guy even more now. I didn't know about the electrocution, drowning, and hangings. I didn't follow the story close enough because it disgusted me to hear about it. Now it disgusts me even more.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 1:59am
I have no idea who this guy is, but i am not liking what i am reading. I don't think killing an innocent animal should be classed as 'a mistake'. I'm pretty sure he knew exactly what he was doing and knew it was wrong! He would probably still be doing it if he didn't get caught.
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 5:07am
Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Originally posted by Kieren24

I don't think he did anything specific to the dogs did he?  He was stupid and made some bad calls by allowing his place to be used but I don't think he was doing the training and putting the dogs in to fight was he?  There were plenty more people more explicitly involved who got off a lot lighter...

I'm glad he is allowed to play, I hope he does amazingly well just to spite all the haters and self-righteous people who have clearly never made any mistakes in their lives.
I am guessing you didn't pay a bit of shtooking attention to what went on and what he was charged with.  He MURDERED dogs that didn't perform well in DOG FIGHTS.  He ELECTROCUTED THEM, DROWNED THEM, AND HUNG THEM.  Yes HE did those things himself not just the other guys involved.  You know why they got off lighter???  They told the shtooking truth and didn't proclaim their innocence then only tell the truth once everyone else did like Vick. 

So I guess all of us who think that is WRONG and is way worse than a mistake are just full of spite and hate.  Have I made mistakes and poor decisions before hell yes.  Have I willingly murdered animals because they did not do well at fighting other animals no I have not. 
 
Yeah, you can't just make stuff up... you can bold my post all you like; he was found guilty of financing the operation and that was pretty much it.
 
Yes he said he knew that some of the others killed the dogs but he didn't do it himself and wasn't found guilty of it either.
 
So no... HE didn't do those things... but he did know about it which doesn't make it right... in fact it is terrible but that doesn't mean he should be treated like he killed the dogs himself... get off the band wagon and stop reading the Sports Illustrated hysteria.
 
Unfortunately for him he took a lot of the rap and those guys who did do the killing (and a disgusting inhumane way they chose to do it) got similar sentances.
 
I suppose only time will tell... and it'll be interesting to see how the Phillie fans react when he throws his first pick.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 5:44am
He did do those things.  HE killed the dogs.  Here is the indictment.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0717072vick2.html

In April, prosecutors allege, Vick, Peace, and Quanis Phillips, "executed approximately 8 dogs that did not perform well in 'testing' sessions." These animals, the indictment claims, were killed "by various methods, including hanging, drowning, and slamming at least one dog's body to the ground." (18 pages)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2983121

With three associates prepared to testify that he brutally executed dogs and bankrolled gambling, the NFL star agreed Monday to "accept full responsibility" for his role in a dogfighting ring and plead guilty to federal conspiracy charges.

He killed the dogs so lets just agree on that point.  Now you can argue if you like that he only plead guilty to conspiracy charges.  However that doesn't change the fact that he killed the dogs by hanging them, electrocuting them, and slamming their heads into the ground.  Now if thinking that is way worse than just a mistake makes me full of hate and spite and blah blah blah that is fine.  I have already stated in this thread that I think everyone who serves their debt to society deserves a second chance. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 5:57am
Think of all the ANTS! OMG! Kids are burning them everyday!

I love dogs just as much as the next person, but
Come on... he did something stupid and horrible, but he suffered the consequences. We need to move on. If he does it again, then this whole argument is moot he deserves it.

Why shouldn't he get a second chance? This guy is not crazy.. he was just stupid...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 6:09am
Originally posted by Kieren24

Originally posted by BRUIZZA

Originally posted by Kieren24

I don't think he did anything specific to the dogs did he?  He was stupid and made some bad calls by allowing his place to be used but I don't think he was doing the training and putting the dogs in to fight was he?  There were plenty more people more explicitly involved who got off a lot lighter...

I'm glad he is allowed to play, I hope he does amazingly well just to spite all the haters and self-righteous people who have clearly never made any mistakes in their lives.
I am guessing you didn't pay a bit of shtooking attention to what went on and what he was charged with.  He MURDERED dogs that didn't perform well in DOG FIGHTS.  He ELECTROCUTED THEM, DROWNED THEM, AND HUNG THEM.  Yes HE did those things himself not just the other guys involved.  You know why they got off lighter???  They told the shtooking truth and didn't proclaim their innocence then only tell the truth once everyone else did like Vick. 

So I guess all of us who think that is WRONG and is way worse than a mistake are just full of spite and hate.  Have I made mistakes and poor decisions before hell yes.  Have I willingly murdered animals because they did not do well at fighting other animals no I have not. 
 
Yeah, you can't just make stuff up... you can bold my post all you like; he was found guilty of financing the operation and that was pretty much it.
 
Yes he said he knew that some of the others killed the dogs but he didn't do it himself and wasn't found guilty of it either.
 
So no... HE didn't do those things... but he did know about it which doesn't make it right... in fact it is terrible but that doesn't mean he should be treated like he killed the dogs himself... get off the band wagon and stop reading the Sports Illustrated hysteria.
 
Unfortunately for him he took a lot of the rap and those guys who did do the killing (and a disgusting inhumane way they chose to do it) got similar sentances.
 
I suppose only time will tell... and it'll be interesting to see how the Phillie fans react when he throws his first pick.
 

Let the back-tracking begin. 

 

My guess is that you didn't pay all that much attention to what was happening and when.  Vick's indictment was for more than financing dog fighting.  Sure, the conviction was on the grounds that he financed the ring, but come on man.  Sworn testimony? Who are we kidding here?

 

I, too, feel as if I'm on the fence.  To me, 24 months for the brutality and heartlessness exhibited wasn't enough.  It is hard for me to accept, as a dog lover, that 24 months in prison would change somebody's mind THAT much.  However, our judicial system decided that was the sentence for which he had to repay was 24 months.  If the murder of a person is 360 months to life in prison, I hardly think the (repeated and malicious) murder of an animal is worth only 24.  So mathematically speaking, that means that a dog's life is worth no more than .83% of a human's life ([24 months / 360 months] / 8 dogs).  I guess it just didn’t seem like enough to me.

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 7:49am
http://sports.espn.go.com/photo/2007/0824/vicksummary.pdf

that's the summary of facts that Vick agreed to. in line 13, it talks about killing the dogs and it states that Vick did NOT kill the dogs. or at least, he denies it. whether or not he killed them, it doesn't really matter. wrong is wrong, it's done with, and he's on the Eagles now.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug/18/2009 at 8:13am
It just says at one point he didn't kill dogs at that time.  If you scroll down to page 8 and 9 it states and I am quoting directly here.

"32. In or about Aprl 2007, PEACE, PHILLIPS, VICK and two others "rolled" or "tested" additional "Bad Newz Kennels" dogs by putting the dogs through fighting sessions at 1915 Moonlight Road to determine which animals were good fighters.  PEACE, PHILLIPS, and VICK agreed to the killing of 6-8 dogs that did not perform well in "testing" sessions at 1915 Moonight Road and all of those dogs were killed by various methods, including hanging and drowning.  VICK agress and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforrs of PEACE, PHILLIPS, and VICK."

So yeah he didn't do the killing the first time but he did in 2007.  At least that is what I gather from the statement.  VICK agress and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforrs of PEACE, PHILLIPS, and VICK."
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