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Burton Custon Flying vs Gnu Riders Choice

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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Burton Custon Flying vs Gnu Riders Choice
    Posted: Nov/21/2013 at 9:30pm
HI Riders!
Looking for a little help here.
My Specs:
6'2", 180lb , Boot size 13.

My Friend is selling me Burton Custom Flying V 162w (2012) "squeezebox" with 2011 burton cartel EST bindings for $250 .
Board and bindings are in excellent shape, Like new. He rode it only 2 days in powder.
I tried riding this board after being on burton Joystick 156w 2010 model -very light . and I felt like it was much harder for me to handle it than my joystick and it feels defiantly heavier and harder to spin.

I was looking at Gnu Riders Choice 158 wide and I really like the board specs. But if I go ahead and buy it I will:
1) Spend $450 min for a new board
2) Buy new none EST Binding 170-180 $ (Cartel 2013)

My questions are:

1) Should I get my friend's board and bindings? Is board too big for my specs? Do I just need to get used to it?
2) Should I buy my friend's board an bindings and sell it for a higher price? and use profit for new GNU board and Cartels. He is fine with me doing that.
3) Which Board is better as ("go anywhere, do everything board")?
4) Does EST tech improve board feel/flex vs non-EST. Is it really noticeable?
5) How does GNU hold up without metal edges around nose and tail?

I would like not to spend a lot of money and go with option #1
But if BUrton will affect my riding in any way and GNU will be a total winner then I don't mind to pay extra for more fun.

Thank you

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  Quote vicente Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/21/2013 at 11:11pm
I'm 6'2 and 165 ish I ride a 157 gnu riders choice and a 162 altered genetics, both are phenomenal boards, AG/eco genetics is just a little more awesome. another board I really reccomend looking at is the thrive renegade they are on sale at the thrive snowboards website right now for around 200$ great boards I own one of those as well by far the best board you can buy for the money they hold up to anything else on the market IMO, just google thrives web site you would be fine on the 160 if your boots have shrinktech you won't have a problem on the 157. 

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  Quote JDiggidy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/22/2013 at 9:59am
Lots to get into here, so I will add my 2 pennies where I see fit.

1) $250 is damn near free when getting a new board and top notch bindings.  You will pay nearly that much for this year's Cartel ESTs alone.  If price is your thing, buy that setup and off you go.  You can always put a few days on it and see how you like the set up (after it is set up for you and you get more used to it), as you are not opposed to selling it for some cash for the Gnu setup.

2) I'm a big supporter of the Rider's Choice.  I've ridden one before (granted, this was at least 5 years ago as a shop demo, so take it as it is), but I did enjoy the ride.  My Gnu Danny Kass is basically the same board, just spec'ed out a bit for DK's riding (DK has quasi-glass for example).  I believe the RC will have a little more rocker than the DK.  I love my DK, and it absolutely changed the way I see snowboarding.  I can't say enough good things about magna-traction either.  Some people don't like it, I'm not one of them.

The flying V shape will be similar, so IMO; you can't lose with either board as far as shape is concerned.  And B's frostbite edges may help a bit on harder surfaces.

3) You asked for durability with a Gnu board having no edges around the tip and tail: I have a solid 20-25 days on my DK, and I ride it hard in trees and rocks and everything not nice, and I have had zero issues.  My Burton Love delaminated on me towards the front toe edge when I hit something (i mean, shiz happens when you ride, right?) but my DK has yet to suffer any damage like that.  I'm not sure if it really lessens the weight of the board that much, but I have had zero problems with it.

4) all in all, going from a 156 Joystick to a 162 Custom or any larger size RC is going to be a heck of a difference.  The joystick's all rockered shape is just going to feel different from either of them for sure!
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/22/2013 at 4:12pm
Originally posted by JDiggidy


Lots to get into here, so I will add my 2 pennies where I see fit.

1) $250 is damn near free when getting a new board and top notch bindings.  You will pay nearly that much for this year's Cartel ESTs alone.  If price is your thing, buy that setup and off you go.  You can always put a few days on it and see how you like the set up (after it is set up for you and you get more used to it), as you are not opposed to selling it for some cash for the Gnu setup.
2) I'm a big supporter of the Rider's Choice.  I've ridden one before (granted, this was at least 5 years ago as a shop demo, so take it as it is), but I did enjoy the ride.  My Gnu Danny Kass is basically the same board, just spec'ed out a bit for DK's riding (DK has quasi-glass for example).  I believe the RC will have a little more rocker than the DK.  I love my DK, and it absolutely changed the way I see snowboarding.  I can't say enough good things about magna-traction either.  Some people don't like it, I'm not one of them.
The flying V shape will be similar, so IMO; you can't lose with either board as far as shape is concerned.  And B's frostbite edges may help a bit on harder surfaces.
3) You asked for durability with a Gnu board having no edges around the tip and tail: I have a solid 20-25 days on my DK, and I ride it hard in trees and rocks and everything not nice, and I have had zero issues.  My Burton Love delaminated on me towards the front toe edge when I hit something (i mean, shiz happens when you ride, right?) but my DK has yet to suffer any damage like that.  I'm not sure if it really lessens the weight of the board that much, but I have had zero problems with it.
4) all in all, going from a 156 Joystick to a 162 Custom or any larger size RC is going to be a heck of a difference.  The joystick's all rockered shape is just going to feel different from either of them for sure!



Thank you. I guess I will go for 162 FV and see how it handles and will try to get used to it. Then I will decide what to do.
Thank you for your help
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  Quote milutinho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/22/2013 at 7:41pm
if it's up to a burton flying v and anything else, i usually go with anything else...but when that anything else is a riders choice then its really an easy choice (no pun intended). especially that 2012 model of the custom flying v...probably the worst one they ever made in terms of holding an edge and riding on anything other than pow or perfect groomers.
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/23/2013 at 6:40pm
I got you bro. Most likely I will try to sell my friend's setup and get RC instead. What are the best bindings to match this all mountain machete?
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  Quote mandapanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 6:22am
Ew burton ewwwww ! Dont go with burton everrrrrr
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  Quote milutinho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 8:12am
well not never...the custom in camber is great, i used to ride that for many seasons. ive heard nothing but great things about the custom x as well. The fish is also awesome. i would just stay away from any flying v
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  Quote keljai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 8:27am
Originally posted by mandapanda

Ew burton ewwwww ! Dont go with burton everrrrrr


and why not
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  Quote vicente Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 9:40am
As a ski tech, I can tell you burtons fit and finish sucks, the old stuff from the canada and US days was really good, but the newer stuff is so bad I can tell the difference from across the room if it's lying base up. Quite honestly while the indigents aren't as good from a finish side a lot of lamars are looking better then burton.   

Oh yea and mervin (gnu, lib) makes some of the toughest boards in the industry my AG has a solid 90 days on it and I ride it really hard, have dropped 3 or 4 ft onto some pretty nasty rock and I think it hurt me more then the board. The nice thing about not having full metal edges is if you bust open the end of you board it's a pretty easy fix, if you have edges though getting them back in or replacing a section and screwing everything in place is a bit harder. 

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  Quote belleayre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 9:51am
Originally posted by vicente

As a ski tech, I can tell you burtons fit and finish sucks, the old stuff from the canada and US days was really good, but the newer stuff is so bad I can tell the difference from across the room if it's lying base up. Quite honestly well the indigents aren't as good from a finish side a lot of lamars are looking better then burton.   

Ouch! Aren't their better boards like the Custom still made in Austria? There was a world of difference between my Burton made in Austria Sierra Crew and made in China Stunt. But having switched to Lib Tech I'm not looking back.
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  Quote vicente Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 9:58am
you would think so but even the the good stuff like customs and custom X if you put a true bar on it looks like the ocean on a stormy day, snowboards are supposed to be flat, some of them are so bad you can't actually grind/sand them smooth to put a proper base pattern on because there just isn't enough base. 

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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 10:51am
Understood. Interesting. Thank you. You made me want to get rid of this setup and get GNU RC even more :)

BTW this is a note on my old 2010 Burton Joystick . It says handmade in Austria. I believe already mine Custom FV also has the same note but it is covered by the bindings and I am too lazy now to mess with it for a picture   



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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 11:07am
Actually this is a second time I have bought this setup from my friend. I bought it from him last season and thought I would keep it but as I mention earlier it was harder for me to handle it after my Joystick and I returned it to him. Not that I hated the board or bindings . I enjoyed it. It was just different.
I Just bought it from him again for 150$ . Could't resist the price. But now I am looking for selling it and Getting Gnu RC and Cartel Bindings . Does anyone know where to get the best price these days? Sierrasnowboard.com is lone gone


BTW do Cartels suck too? I actually love my Cartel EST but I haven't tried any of Union or Rome bindings ever ?
Are they any better or worse?

Thanks
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  Quote milutinho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 5:43pm
no Cartels do not suck...at all. they are awesome.
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  Quote sideways99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/24/2013 at 6:25pm
Originally posted by mandapanda

Ew burton ewwwww ! Dont go with burton everrrrrr

Without giving a reason that is a stupid statement but looking at your previous posts I wouldn't expect anything more from you.

People hate Burton because of the name.  The mid-to-upper level gear is high quality.  Hell, even the stuff sold at the big box stores is decent compared to the alternatives (5150, Lamar).

Cartels are great bindings.  Bullet-proof, comfortable, dependable.

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  Quote keljai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 5:46am
Cartles are great bindings, fit all does all imo.
 
I like burton goods myself, usually the pricing is higher, but the resale value is maintained better for the most part also
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  Quote sideways99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 6:43am
^ While I agree with most of your post I disagree with the "usually the pricing is higher" point.  Burton is priced competitively when you compare the products to the competition's similar products.  A good mid-to-high end Burton board will cost about the same as a good Lib Tech board.  Quality Burton bindings will cost about the same as quality Union bindings.  And so on.  I think it's a common misconception that Burton is over-priced.
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  Quote keljai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 8:30am
it is true they are in the same range but cartels run 229? forces is 199, not huge but thats a 10% difference. And yes, l work in the finance industry :P
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  Quote JDiggidy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 10:17am
Originally posted by keljai

it is true they are in the same range but cartels run 229? forces is 199, not huge but thats a 10% difference. And yes, l work in the finance industry :P

I wouldn't put the Cartel and the Force as the same binding.  I'd say the cartel is more like the Atlas for $240 for the current year's model.

Also, that being said, Di, the Atlas is a solid choice. They are so nice.  I mean, just bomb proof, responsive, and comfy.  For me it was between Atlas and the Cartel, I went Atlas the first year they came out ($230 that year).
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 4:14pm
Originally posted by JDiggidy


Originally posted by keljai

it is true they are in the same range but cartels run 229? forces is 199, not huge but thats a 10% difference. And yes, l work in the finance industry :P

I wouldn't put the Cartel and the Force as the same binding.  I'd say the cartel is more like the Atlas for $240 for the current year's model.
Also, that being said, Di, the Atlas is a solid choice. They are so nice.  I mean, just bomb proof, responsive, and comfy.  For me it was between Atlas and the Cartel, I went Atlas the first year they came out ($230 that year).


Thank you. I will check out Atlas too.
I just lost an opportunity to buy Cartels 2013 for 120.
Do you guys know if 450 a good price for GNU RC 2014 ?

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  Quote sideways99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 4:52pm
2013 Cartels for $120 was a sweet deal, where was it?


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  Quote keljai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 5:26pm
Originally posted by sideways99

2013 Cartels for $120 was a sweet deal, where was it?




+1 maybe they have other sweet deals
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 7:25pm
It Was on EVO Black Friday Sale + 20% off with coupon .
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/25/2013 at 7:48pm
Actually it still going but code expired. I just checked. Still good prices though
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  Quote JDiggidy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/26/2013 at 8:10am
Without doing much research, I'd say $450 for a new 2014 Rider's Choice would be a fair price.  I'm sure some of our resident shop guys can chime in and confirm/deny, but I know the "top line" Gnu's this year are running in the mid $500's range, so that seems right to me... about $100 off in fact! :)

If you can navigate their ridiculous website, evo can be a good place to score.  I don't know why, but it never seems like i can find what i'm looking for (if i'm just browsing) on their website.  Not as bad as department of goods, but still annoying.  
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 4:49pm
Originally posted by JDiggidy

Without doing much research, I'd say $450 for a new 2014 Rider's Choice would be a fair price.  I'm sure some of our resident shop guys can chime in and confirm/deny, but I know the "top line" Gnu's this year are running in the mid $500's range, so that seems right to me... about $100 off in fact! :)

If you can navigate their ridiculous website, evo can be a good place to score.  I don't know why, but it never seems like i can find what i'm looking for (if i'm just browsing) on their website.  Not as bad as department of goods, but still annoying.  


Thank you! They say it is a New-Blem model, same as new but with Grafic or esthetic defect. That is why it is 450. But they couldn't specify what is the exact defect when I called them. They said they do not have an access to the board to look at it. I don't think it is anything major otherwise Gnu wouldn't provide a full warranty on it as on a new deck. I may go for it if Black Friday won't help to get a better deal.
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  Quote keljai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 5:35pm
yeah technically speacking blems are defects but would not affect the ride... 
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  Quote sideways99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 6:27pm
Originally posted by keljai

yeah technically speacking blems are defects but would not affect the ride... 

Yep, board should be great, buy it!!!

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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 6:29pm
Ok. Let's say I am going for GNU RC and Cartels. Would my Burton Hail 2010 work well with this setup or do I need a stiffer boot like Ion to maximize the match? I want to stay with Burton boots because of their reduction tech. I have shoe size 13

Thanks
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  Quote spenser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 8:31pm
it simply doesn't work that way.  boots and bindings create the interface between you and the board, and that interface is all preference.  do you like the flex of the hail?  if so, keep them.  if you want a stiffer boot, get a stiffer boot.
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/27/2013 at 9:58pm
Originally posted by spenser

it simply doesn't work that way.  boots and bindings create the interface between you and the board, and that interface is all preference.  do you like the flex of the hail?  if so, keep them.  if you want a stiffer boot, get a stiffer boot.



I actually never tried riding with stiff
Boot. Isn't that a stiff board and bindings require a stiff boot to handle it the way it was intended ? I thought soft boots,boards and bindings are designed mainly for park. Mid stiffness for all mountain riding and stiff stuff for high speed and backcountry.
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  Quote mandapanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Nov/30/2013 at 6:14pm
I like to support the small companies to promote more snowboarding...i refuse to buy burton
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 7:15am
OK, Thank you all. Now I have GNU Riders Choice 2014 as #1 on my shopping list. Are there any other board (wide a must boot size 13 ;)) that can be better in this category (go anywhere do everything)?
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  Quote milutinho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 8:01am
The jones mountIn twin. It can do it all. I have last years and I hear this years is even better from the reviews I've read.
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  Quote Di Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 8:21am
Originally posted by milutinho

The jones mountIn twin. It can do it all. I have last years and I hear this years is even better from the reviews I've read.


That is exactly what I was looking at as alternative to RC. Worth to consider. Would be nice to hear someone's opinion who actually demoed both boards

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  Quote JDiggidy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 11:33am
Originally posted by mandapanda

I like to support the small companies to promote more snowboarding...i refuse to buy burton

Just stop it.  Your 10 word posts don't add anything, and are usually so off base anyway they are just starting to annoy peeps.  

Please recall your little gem on August 23rd at 3:06pm "Restricted is always best"....  So 3 months ago Burton's Restricted line was the best... but now you don't buy them 'cause they're the "man??"  Ummm... 

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  Quote sideways99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 12:15pm
^ Nice call-out.  Funny how "Restricted is always best..." and "i refuse to buy burton" from the same useless person.
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  Quote humblerooster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 12:37pm
Wait, why are people hating on the flying v? I rode that board for a couple times on the mountain and I loved it. The pop was huge, the board was lighter than mine, so that was nice. Interesting to see people don't like the board.
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  Quote spenser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec/01/2013 at 1:03pm
Originally posted by Di

Originally posted by spenser

it simply doesn't work that way.  boots and bindings create the interface between you and the board, and that interface is all preference.  do you like the flex of the hail?  if so, keep them.  if you want a stiffer boot, get a stiffer boot.



I actually never tried riding with stiff
Boot. Isn't that a stiff board and bindings require a stiff boot to handle it the way it was intended ? I thought soft boots,boards and bindings are designed mainly for park. Mid stiffness for all mountain riding and stiff stuff for high speed and backcountry.
a lot of people would tend to ride more supportive boots for that type of riding, but there are also plenty who don't.  it really is all preference, bottom line.  there are people who ride stiffer gear for park, and softer for backcountry/etc.  take gigi ruf for example... he rides medium flex boots and medium-soft bindings, and he rips!  then you have guys running stiff boots and bindings on soft boards in the park.  there are some jibbers who ride the burton driver X boot, for example, and that's a fairly stiff boot.

it just comes down to the interface that you prefer.  some people like a looser more mobile interface, while others prefer a more rigid and powerful interface.  all about your own personal style.

it doesn't mean it's all random.. you can figure it out for yourself.. I'm just saying at the end of the day, it's all about what you like.
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